Low Carb San Diego Success Story Interviews with Carole Freeman.

Transcript:

Carole Freeman:
Well, good morning everyone.

Speaker 1:
Good morning. Good morning. [crosstalk 00:00:26].

Carole Freeman:
Hello. Welcome back.

Speaker 1:
Thank you, I got my coffee.

Carole Freeman:
May name is Carole Freeman and I’m going to start out by sharing my keto success story with you. Then after that, we’ll just have volunteers, people come up and share their success story. We’re here at Low Carb USA 2019, which is the fourth year that this conference has been held.

Carole Freeman:
How many of you are first year attendees? Okay. Second year? Anybody three times?

Speaker 1:
I’ve been to two or three.

Carole Freeman:
Four times?

Speaker 1:
[crosstalk 00:01:00].

Carole Freeman:
All right, cool. We’ve got the full representation. We’ve got freshman, sophomore, juniors, and seniors here today. I found keto the hard way. You’re going to hear a lot of stories today that are inspiring.

Carole Freeman:
Also, if you want to share too, and you don’t feel like, “Oh, my gosh I don’t even have this … I didn’t die,” like some of them people’s stories are going to be. It’s okay, because everybody’s story is unique and it’s going to inspire somebody else.

Carole Freeman:
We were at dinner last night with Tyler from Ketogains. And he was talking about how you affect one person and that affects somebody else. And then it ripples and waves of people that you impact. So sharing your story is really, really powerful because it just is part of what’s contributing to changing the world that we’re in. And the health of this entire planet.

Carole Freeman:
I was trained as a nutritionist. I have six figure in student loans to prove it. I’ve always been passionate about helping people be as healthy as they can, body and mind. So I did my undergrad in nutrition, and then I got a very specialized master’s degree in both nutrition and clinical health psychology.

Carole Freeman:
I was always looking for what’s the answer to help people be at a healthy body weight, but also love themselves and keep it sustainable? I didn’t find that in my training, although I spent probably 20 years studying psychology and all of that. It actually took a very impactful car accident that I was in, in 2014.

Carole Freeman:
I was rear ended by a destructive driver that was going about 35 miles an hour. I ended up disabled and bedridden the better part of a year and a half from a brain injury. Crush injuries to my legs. And all the while I’m getting heavier and heavier, sicker and sicker. And I couldn’t figure out what to do.

Carole Freeman:
The doctors, after 172 different doctors visitors, they just wanted to tell me, “Oh, you’re depressed. You have fibromyalgia. Just get over it. Positive mind thoughts, that’s what you need to do.” So I went back to my own training. And I thought, what do I know about nutrition that could help heal me?

Carole Freeman:
I remember about this much information about a ketogenic diet as a treatment for epilepsy. I reasoned that, well, epilepsy is something that’s not working quite right in the brain. Perhaps that’s some that would help me as well. So I started reading everything I could online. And I became hopeful, but also cautiously optimistic.

Carole Freeman:
Actually, I was pretty pessimistic, because I’d learned in school that there was no way to actually lose weight and keep it off. That it was actually cruel to encourage people to try to lose weight because they were just going to fail. And they were going to gain it back, and then they were just going to hate themselves even more.

Carole Freeman:
So I went into it doubtful that I could stick with it. But I also was so desperate to get out of bed. Within days the symptoms that I had, that had me bedridden were just vanishing. And all the symptoms of the brain injury, even the chronic pain syndrome that I had in my legs, which I’ll mention it because some people …

Carole Freeman:
It’s a rare thing, but some people may identify with it. Is chronic regional pain syndrome I was developing in my legs. This is a chronic, progressive, disabling pain syndrome that happens, and that went into remission. So I finally had the missing piece that I’d been looking for in my practice all these years. To be able to provide people with this delicious, sustainable way of eating, that also helps them be healthy as well.

Carole Freeman:
So that is an abbreviated version of my success story. I’ve been following keto now for a little over four years, May 18th, 2015 is my anniversary. So now, I’d like to invite whoever’s brave enough to come up and share their success story. We’re just going to continue and share our successes. Oh, yeah?

Speaker 1:
How about failure stories?

Carole Freeman:
No, this is a success story session.

Speaker 1:
No. Well, you have ups and downs.

Carole Freeman:
Right. Well, that’s the journey story. So today we’re sharing how you got to keto and the successes you’ve experienced on that. Mike, do you want to come up?

Michael Burdah:
Sure.

Carole Freeman:
Okay. He’s a plant in the audience, so it’s fine. Welcome, Michael Burdah, welcome.

Michael Burdah:
Check, check. It works.

Carole Freeman:
You’re welcome. Where are you here from?

Michael Burdah:
I’m here from Seattle, Washington.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, my gosh. He’s my neighbor, so …

Michael Burdah:
It’s true I could run to Carole’s house in probably about 25 minutes if I needed to.

Carole Freeman:
But we didn’t know each other before keto. We met basically online group.

Michael Burdah:
Yes, that’s correct.

Carole Freeman:
Yeah. All right, so share your story.

Michael Burdah:
Sure. I was pretty normal weight growing up. And then all of a sudden I turned 21, where alcohol was legal and available. I had a decent job, so I could go out to bars and restaurants and have really tasty, really carby food anytime I want, because I had plenty of disposable income.

Michael Burdah:
So I all of a sudden saw myself at 230 pounds. I had pretty horrible acid reflux. My lovely wife was pregnant with our daughter Mazzy, and I realized that something needed to change. I’m an engineer by trade. I work at a major phone company that probably everyone here’s heard of, but maybe I shouldn’t say. I don’t know.

Carole Freeman:
It doesn’t matter.

Michael Burdah:
[crosstalk 00:06:52].

Carole Freeman:
We’re not going to say anything bad about them. No trade secrets disclosed today.

Michael Burdah:
So I’m an engineer at T-Mobile at their corporate HQ. I say that us engineers, we’re not lazy, we’re efficient. I was trying to figure out what diet I should go on to lose weight. I realized I could either count to 20 for carbs or count to 2,000 for calories. That was my thought process in 2014.

Michael Burdah:
I’m like, I’m this lazy guy. I don’t want to count to 2,000. I’ll count to 20 instead, so it worked really well. I was basically eating unlimited amounts of protein and fat, and I lost about 40 pounds. I was super happy with how things were going. But then I just completely just stalled out. Completely stalled out.

Michael Burdah:
That lasted about six months or so, and then I started seeing this gentleman named Ted Neiman. I don’t know if anyone in the audience has heard of him. He’s actually my doctor back home. I started seeing him, and I was telling him what I was eating. How much cream I was putting in my coffee and how much cheese I was putting on everything.

Michael Burdah:
He had me back off of the concentrated fats a little bit, focus on protein a little bit more. Around this time I found Ketogains as well. That’s how I broke that six month stall, where I lost another 40 pounds. Leveled out at about 150 or so. Been doing a lot of weight training, so I’ve gained 10 pounds with the same pants size. So that’s wasn’t body fat that was gained. Here I am five and a half years later, and that’s my success story.

Carole Freeman:
Excellent. Any tips you have for people that are struggling?

Michael Burdah:
I’m a big fan of people really watching their electrolyte intake. Because that seems to be just a common problem. Even like when people are like, “I’ve been on the diet for two years, and whatever.” It’s like, “No. Seriously track your electrolytes.” If you track your macros, track that the exact same way. That’s a tip. Yes?

Speaker 1:
How do you track your electrolytes?

Michael Burdah:
I use a app called Cronometer. And then [crosstalk 00:09:27].

Carole Freeman:
They’re here as well.

Michael Burdah:
And they’re here, so just tracking that as well. I find that the less food that I’m eating and the more body fat I’m oxidizing, the more my electrolyte needs go up. The more physical activity I do, the more I need electrolytes. I climbed Mount St. Helen’s recently on saltwater. I literally just drank saltwater up the mountain, and that was awesome.

Carole Freeman:
That reminds me you share a little bit about how your activity levels changed before and after keto?

Michael Burdah:
Yeah. My activity level activity before keto was I was a home brewer of beer. I made a lot of beer. Last time I was actually here in San Diego was actually for the National Home Brewers. I was an awarded winning home brewer. I have medals and awards and everything.

Michael Burdah:
Then a couple of weeks after I started doing low carb, I’d say that my brain told my but to just get up and run. So I started running, and I found some podcast. That was sort of my community. I didn’t have any friends that were doing the diet or anything. So I listened to a lot of podcasts. Eventually, I started lifting weights, which I think is probably a better approach for body composition than cardio. But I still do like doing cardio for fun, hiking, and I’m a soccer player as well.

Speaker 1:
Can I ask another question [crosstalk 00:11:02]. Sorry, [crosstalk 00:11:03].

Michael Burdah:
Yeah, absolutely. No worries.

Speaker 1:
In terms of getting your electrolytes I’m assuming you’re talking about sodium, magnesium, and potassium?

Michael Burdah:
Yep.

Carole Freeman:
I’ll repeat her question, because that’ll pick up on the audio better. She asked if in terms of tracking electrolytes you’re tracking magnesium, sodium, and potassium?

Speaker 1:
And in which way are you taking them? Are you taking them as a pill, as a drink, [inaudible 00:11:27] or something like that?

Carole Freeman:
Then which way are you taking your supplements, or either your electrolytes?

Michael Burdah:
What I like is basically … Yeah, sodium, magnesium, potassium into a cup with water, lemon, Stevia, and ice. That’s just how I do it for taste preferences.

Speaker 1:
What kind of potassium do you use?

Michael Burdah:
I use what’s called [crosstalk 00:11:52].

Carole Freeman:
What kind of potassium do you use?

Michael Burdah:
What kind of potassium do I use? I use what’s called Lite Salt from Morton’s. You can get it at basically any grocery store.

Carole Freeman:
And Mike is the king of efficiency and frugalness. Is that what you’d call it? Or just minimizing expenditures for maximum results?

Michael Burdah:
Right. Yes, that’s true.

Carole Freeman:
He generates all his own electricity at home as well too. Just a fun fact.

Michael Burdah:
Yeah, that’s true too.

Carole Freeman:
Any other questions for Mike?

Speaker 1:
Do you intermittent fast?

Carole Freeman:
Do you intermittent fast?

Michael Burdah:
I do actually, but for me it’s mostly out of just convenience, and as a way of just managing my total food intake. I can guarantee that, because I’ve done it, I’ve gained body fat doing intermittent fasting from just eating too much. So I do intermittent fast, but I would not really consider it a major component.

Michael Burdah:
Yes?

Speaker 1:
Back to your electrolytes, what form do you take the magnesium?

Carole Freeman:
What form of magnesium do you take?

Michael Burdah:
Okay. I have these magnesium citrate pills basically. Then I also have some magnesium powder because I was trying to clone Tyler’s … Tyler’s in the back there. I was trying to clone his electrolyte supplement element, so I bought all the different powders.

Tyler Cartwrite:
[crosstalk 00:13:26] the recipe on the website, so you didn’t have to work real hard [crosstalk 00:13:30].

Michael Burdah:
Right. Yeah, that’s true.

Carole Freeman:
Also then, what symptoms are you monitoring to know whether you’re getting enough electrolytes or not?

Michael Burdah:
If I’m about to pass out doing deadlights, then I know that my electrolytes are not balanced. If I’m hungry a lot of times that’s just a salt thing, not a actual hunger thing. Any sort of headache, some people say brain fog, I don’t know what that means, but that kind of thing as well.

Speaker 1:
Would you put a teaspoon of salt in a 16 ounce glass of water, or is that way too much?

Michael Burdah:
I would start lower. I would start at maybe a quarter teaspoon and work your way up. Because if you do too much sodium at once bad things will happen.

Carole Freeman:
We call it disaster pants here. With my clients I find they can tolerate about a half a teaspoon in one dose. More than that generally, depending on what they need, will cause a problem.

Michael Burdah:
I would say most of the time if someone is constipated it’s probably an electrolyte issue, not a fiber issue.

Carole Freeman:
The five symptoms that I have my clients watch to let them know, especially salt, that they don’t have enough is constipation, lightheadedness or dizziness, headaches, muscle cramps, fatigue. So if anyone’s suffering any of those on a low carb or keto diet, most likely you’re not intaking enough sodium, specifically. And maybe the other electrolytes as well.

Speaker 1:
That’s interesting because I always thought it was the magnesium that caused the leg cramps. I don’t know, so that’s great [crosstalk 00:15:12].

Carole Freeman:
Yeah, it’s a common one that people think that it’s magnesium and they can’t ever get it resolved. But we get enough salt on board for the most part and most of that resolves. Any other …

Speaker 1:
What about iodine?

Carole Freeman:
Iodine. Actually, I’ll pause this here because we’re going to focus on success stories, instead of specific supplement recommendations and things like that. Just so that we can have time to hear from … There’s a lot of people that want to share. But, we’ll have this room until later too, so thank you, Mike, for sharing your story.

Michael Burdah:
Thank you, Carole.

Speaker 1:
Excellent.

Carole Freeman:
Abby, would you like to come up and share your success story. I love your tee shirt. That’s great.

Abby Ross:
Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
All right, tell us your name and where you’re from.

Abby Ross:
Hi, I’m Abby Ross from Miami with a little Palo Alto in California. So, where to begin? I’m 68, and I got into macrobiotics … You’re familiar with macrobiotics? It’s vegan, but I was adding fish. I did it for 20 years, and enjoyed fabulous success, wonderful.

Abby Ross:
Then, life happens and the middle age spread and well, you know. I read a Belly Fat and I started getting into that. Somebody said, “It just comes to you,” and it came to me. It was just … I want to use the word brainwashed, but brainwashed not to eat what we eat on this diet.

Abby Ross:
So I started eating this way, and I still felt the same vitality and everything. Because I guess I’m blessed with that. I do marathons and I have a lot of energy, so I was thrilled that I kept the same energy. But not to be hungry was the biggest thing ever. I love to eat.

Abby Ross:
In a million years I never thought I’d forget to eat lunch. I mean it’s just unheard of. Now, you call it intermittent fasting. My first meal of the day is 12:00. That’s just the way it is. I was so brainwashed to have breakfast, brainwashed. Okay, so my first meal is at 12:00.

Abby Ross:
I love going out to lunch, I’m retired now, with friends. So I will arrange it to go out 11:30 or 12:00, and that’s just the way it is because I’m not hungry. So I guess that’s intermittent fasting. Also, and I picked this up from one of these wonderful conferences, I don’t do social eating. Isn’t that a nice sentence, I don’t do social eating. So if we were going to eat and I hadn’t seen you, I’d go for a walk. That’s another thing, because I’m not hungry. Okay, so that was absolutely huge. The vitality and not being hungry and the energy.

Abby Ross:
Now, let’s talk about going out. We travel because we’re retired. We have a lot of bonus points and we go all over. To be able to go anywhere in the world and eat this way is what a bonus. I don’t even have to look at a menu, but I do. I don’t have to tell you about avocados and the way we can eat this way. I just absolutely love it. It’s been phenomenal.

Abby Ross:
The main things are, I’m not hungry. I have the vitality that I want. I had gotten down … At the very beginning when I started this, I’m 5’2, I got down to 99 pounds. It was easy. I’m on Weight Watchers. I’m a lifetime Weight Watcher member. I forgot to mention that.

Abby Ross:
I weigh in every single month of my life. For 49 years I’ve done it, only because I don’t want to gain an extra two pounds, because I love to eat. So that was really interesting that I could keep the same vitality and eat.

Abby Ross:
One more thing, the numbers, my cholesterol is high. My cholesterol I high, and that really freaked me out as much as eating lamb chops. It freaked me out. For a long time I kept asking all the people here, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Especially when I asked the people not from the United States, because they viewed the situation differently, let’s put it that way.

Abby Ross:
So my numbers weren’t climbing, but the ratios were good because of the exercise, I guess. Then I was suggested that I take the [inaudible 00:19:21] Calcium Score. I don’t know if you’re going to go into that? Okay. Because in the marathon community people were keeling over.

Abby Ross:
There’s a wonderful test, and I’m not going to go into it now, but it’s great. And it’s not invasive, which is even greater. That made me feel a lot more confident once I had taken that calcium heart scan test, and had it with the high cholesterol. Because I’m still crazy about that, and my doctor doesn’t either, so we don’t discuss that right there.

Abby Ross:
Okay. One more thing, with the number thing, when weighing myself I have one of the scales with the body percent fat. So I got down to 99, which was way too low. I loved it. I mean I loved it, but then I look back at pictures now, it’s crazy.

Abby Ross:
Now, I’m at 116. I love it. I love going out to eat. I love every single thing about this. I go on all the … I love the group and I love everything. So I don’t know if that answers what you want to know, but yeah.

Carole Freeman:
No, that’s great. I wanted to ask you, I learned last night that your husband does not follow this way of eating.

Abby Ross:
Right, right.

Carole Freeman:
Excuse me. So, that can pose special challenges for people.

Abby Ross:
This is a great one. Just make sure he’s not … No. Okay, so-

Carole Freeman:
And hopefully he doesn’t watch this video either.

Abby Ross:
No, this is great. This is such an important point about your health.

Carole Freeman:
So, two questions for you. One is, how is that dynamic between the two of you? Then, I’d also like you to contrast how easy it is for you to travel and eat what you eat, and then how difficult it is for him to travel and try to find something to eat?

Abby Ross:
Bingo. Okay, so we’re married also five oh years, 50, which that deserves some applause, thank you very much. No. Okay. Sometimes in a marriage one person sort of leads the way and then the other kind of gets into it, in some marriages. Okay, well, that happened in this one, and I got into vegan, macrobiotics.

Abby Ross:
1992, I went to a conference. I was swimming in the pool and I met Dr. Spock, Benjamin Spock, and he had just gotten into it. I was a pallbearer at his funeral. He was a fabulous man, and he got me into macrobiotics.

Abby Ross:
I come home I tell my husband I met Dr. Spock and it changed his life. And cleaned out the cabinets and said, “We’re going to be doing it now this way.” It wasn’t really a good move, but we started eating this way, and my husband, David, loved it.

Abby Ross:
David is still a vegan. I don’t know if he knows exactly why, but he’s still doing it. He just turned 70 and he loves doing it. He went to Cafe Gratitude last night, which is a vegan restaurant and they had a keto bowl. Isn’t that great. It’s the other way around. Because normally you would go and have veg it up.

Abby Ross:
So how do we do it? I found when I got him into macrobiotics, I kept nagging and nagging and nagging, and honest to God, once I did not give a whatever, that’s when he came around. When I really didn’t care. Eat your way. Okay, fine. And then he did.

Abby Ross:
So if he ever adapts this way, which I hope he does, but if it happens, it happens once I let go and did not care. So I go and I can look at the menu and David’s looking for an Impossible Burger or something else. What’s that, a Beyond Burger? Okay, good, but I’m eating a lot of different … We’ve worked it out. It’s not a hot spot.

Abby Ross:
I’m trying to think. It’s not a hot spot at all. He comes to the conferences. When we start talking I can tell he’s uncomfortable and would like to leave. So just now I just said, “Are you going to do your run now?” And he went to do his run because he really doesn’t want to hear about macros or blah, blah, blah. We just work it out.

Abby Ross:
The answer to your question is, once I did not care, and once I just let go and lead by example. Lead by example and that’s it.

Carole Freeman:
That’s wonderful. Does anybody have any questions for Abby?

Abby Ross:
It’s wonderful. Eating out and not being hungry and losing weight.

Speaker 1:
When you’re traveling around the world, and you said you’re not even needing to look at a menu, do you ever ask questions like [crosstalk 00:23:30]?

Abby Ross:
Every single time I do. So when I said I-

Carole Freeman:
Let me just repeat the question because then it’ll pick up on the audio better. [crosstalk 00:23:38]. She’s wondering when you’re traveling around the world, do you ask questions about what’s on the menus?

Abby Ross:
Absolutely. I get so creative. If I see avocado on something, yes, they have avocado. So you get creative with that. By chance last night, I was a guest of somebody and I had dinner with Carole. Carole sat across from me. How many times did you see me ask, “Is there sauce on this?” Or, you just do.

Abby Ross:
Lots of times they don’t know, so I go strong. I start off right from the beginning. I hate to say, something I … whatever condition. I’m allergic is great. Does this have whatever? Because I have to. I don’t want … Oh, so you can have a glass of wine on this? Who knew? I mean I have a glass of wine. Prosecco, I don’t know wines, but one of them has a lot of sugar.

Abby Ross:
So for the first week that I was on this I didn’t know that some of it was sparkling and sugar and wine and whatever. But in answer to your question, I totally always ask questions. I would never get a meatloaf or anything. I don’t know what’s in it. Everything is pure. Even at home I like totally pure clean stuff. Does that answer? Does that answer your question?

Abby Ross:
Yeah. I always ask questions. I get a lot, like if there’s a salad, I’ll want Romaine and I’ll want the cheese. I want olive oil on the side. I don’t get so picky like what kind of olive oil. I’m so happy if they have olive oil. A lot of places don’t. It’s just so easy to travel.

Abby Ross:
On airplanes I always bring my own food. I don’t even trust any of that stuff. Eggs are not eggs. No, even like some of pancake places, the batter, that’s not eggs. First of all, eggs that come in a box, that kind of thing. But even if you had to be in that situation, there are a lot of other things. Cream is not cream, all that stuff. I love this way of eating. I love it.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you so much for sharing your story, Abby. Thank you so much for being here.

Abby Ross:
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
Who would like to share their story next? Yes, the lady in the gray/white sweater. Yes, yes, yes. White sweater, yes. Yes, you.

Cocoa:
[crosstalk 00:25:48]. All right.

Carole Freeman:
Come on down. Give it up for …

Cocoa:
Cocoa [inaudible 00:25:54], but it’s Cocoa.

Carole Freeman:
Cocoa. Coming next to the stage we’ve got Cocoa. Welcome.

Cocoa:
Hi. How are you?

Carole Freeman:
Good. How are you?

Cocoa:
Nervous, but I’ll-

Carole Freeman:
Yeah. Tell us your name and where you’re from.

Cocoa:
Okay. My name Sequoro Alameze.

Carole Freeman:
Just a little closer.

Cocoa:
I go by Cocoa, and I’m actually just down the street in Benita so I’m local. And I have you beat. I am a former Weight Watcher’s coach. And I still weigh in as a lifetime member. That’s my story, I’m a former Weight Watcher’s coach.

Cocoa:
The year that I became a coach the program totally changed me. The nine pounds that I was so proud that I had lost in a period of 12 months, I gained it all back plus, plus when the new program came out, which we call Free Style. My hashtag is #freestylesucks. I noticed that what-

Carole Freeman:
This video recording does not reflect the opinions that are expressed here on this interview.

Cocoa:
Sorry about that. Okay, I’ll behave. But what I did notice is that I went to go do my annual and my blood sugar had skyrocketed. They wanted to put me on Metformin. My cholesterol had skyrocketed, and I was following the plan. I’m a meticulous tracker. I was following the plan, and of course, I had gained all my weight back.

Cocoa:
So I had seen a friend post months before that she had lost weight. And her blood levels had regulated and become normal doing keto. So I sent her a message and she bombarded my messenger Facebook with all of these doctors. Because I said, “I only want reputable doctors, MDs.” Because I’m kind of anal that way.

Cocoa:
That’s what I want. I want to see doctors that use this style of eating. It took six weeks to read, listen, check out books. My husband thought I was nuts. Within three months I had lost 21 pounds. My blood sugar had regulated. My cholesterol was still a little elevated. But I ran into Dave Feldman, and oh, my word, that just changed my world.

Cocoa:
Since then, I’m just devoted to this lifestyle. My husband, like Abby’s, kind of just, “I’m not doing this. Don’t talk to me about this. This is not me.” I’m like, “Okay.” Well, since the beginning of the year my husband has lost 35 pounds.

Cocoa:
We go down to New Mexico and he pulls everything out of the tacos. He unwraps his enchiladas and eats the cheese. He takes off the breading off his chile rellenos and eats the chile and eats the cheese. And he’s still not doing keto though. He’s in denial.

Cocoa:
But it’s amazing, my grandchildren are now keto. Because we found gluten to really be impacting their joints and their health. So they are now keto and that’s four of them, including the two-year old. The 10-year old reads all the ingredients and says, “Oh, Nana, no, we can’t have that because it has too much sugar.” We have to find the spaghetti sauce. “Nana, never mind just make your own spaghetti sauce. All of these have too much sugar.”

Cocoa:
They love going to Costco, but they always ask the sample lady, “Well, does it have sugar? Does it have gluten?” These are 10, eight, six year old kids. The interesting story, I digress, but my daughter was shopping with all of them at Costco. The little one, he’s two, he was sitting in the cart, and this man kept running across the isle, he just stopped and said, “How is your child able to sit for all this time?” She goes, “Well, they’re just well behaved.” And the 10-year old responded, “No, Mom, we do have sugar crashes.” Isn’t that insightful for a 10-year old? I thought so.

Cocoa:
So, anyway, just to say, I’ve led a lot of people down the keto road. And I am currently coaching one, two, three, four, five Weight Watcher’s coaches.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, wow.

Cocoa:
And that’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you, Cocoa, for sharing. That’s wonderful.

Cocoa:
Any questions?

Carole Freeman:
Questions for Cocoa?

Cocoa:
No? Okay, well [crosstalk 00:30:29].

Carole Freeman:
Thank you so much. Congratulations on your success.

Cocoa:
Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
Who’s going to come up next to share their story? Yes? Hello, welcome, Greg.

Greg:
I’m Greg, and I’m here with my wife Susan, from New Hope, Pennsylvania.

Carole Freeman:
Okay. So far the farthest away that’s in the group maybe?

Greg:
Yeah, we were torn between going to Ketofest, which was a three hour drive, or coming here, and-

Carole Freeman:
Boy, well, don’t tell them that we won out.

Greg:
Anyway, 23, almost 24 years ago my father … Here I go again. Sorry. I’m choked up and I didn’t get it out. Almost 24 years ago my father died from type II diabetes complications, and it was ugly. My mother nagged me for years, something apparently women are good at.

Greg:
Anyway, I finally went to the doctor’s. The doctor said, “So, why are you here?” And I told him, “My mother’s nagging me about it.” He looked at me, he says, “You don’t have diabetes.” So two days later I get this frantic call from him on my cellphone and he said, “You need to go to the pharmacy immediately, your fasting blood sugar,” sorry, “is over 400.”

Greg:
I thought I’d worked this when I was telling you this story. Anyway, so given what I saw, it’s like this is a frigging death sentence. Anyway, fast forward and I came across this book by Dr. Bernstein, who is on the east coast. I looked at this book, and it was like, “It’s going on the shelf. This guy’s nuts.”

Greg:
I’m a scientific skeptic, or at least I thought I was. So, Gary Taubes comes out with his article and they shredded him. I mean, “This guy is an idiot.” Da-da-da-da-da-da. And some of these people are really respected. I came across the first time in my life …

Greg:
I think it’s relevant to why we’re having such a hard time getting this movement off the ground, is that cognitive dissonance. So I had two things in my mind that were opposite. The one is low fat, carb, and calories in/calories out, yada-yada.

Greg:
Then there’s the history of dieting and what Gary Taubes and Nina Teicholz and other people have done. So I’d become comfortable with this dissonance. So I can hold now, multiple ideas that are opposite and be with the discomfort. Sort of like on a fast, and I get started and I’m uncomfortable but I can look down the road and just be with it.

Greg:
So, anyway, about 58 weeks ago, because I log everything, I’m an engineer, I started doing 100% keto. Where I had dabbled with low carb-ish stuff. And I am down now 60 pounds from my start, and … Darn, I don’t mind getting emotional, it stops me from talking. That’s the problem.

Greg:
I’m down 60 pounds, so I’m at my, quote, fighting weight. And the last things I’m working on are to through autophagi to remove the loose skin around my stomach. My doctor say, who’s big in this community, Dr. Sodikoff, I just switched to him, says it’s a vanity thing. I disagree.

Greg:
Number two, I have a tinnitus, ringing in the ears, and Dr. Bosworth says you can get rid of it through ketosis, lowering inflammation. And autophagy, getting rid of the calcification. Actually, there were three things. Well, that’s good, two’s good. Anyway, so, I’m good to go, and I talk too much.

Carole Freeman:
No. Greg, that was great. Thank you so much. I’m so sorry for your loss. And thank you for being so vulnerable with us and sharing something that’s obviously extremely important and impactful. I shared earlier with everyone, before everyone was here, but we never who we’re going to impact with our story.

Greg:
So, I’m here as an advocate. I am an engineer, totally, and I talk to absolutely everyone about this. My theory is something like the hundredth monkey. That is, we all got to get out there in the trenches and do what we do, however we do it. There’s a lot of people who are out there, like the people that are on the front lines, they literally are, picture World War I. They’re in the trenches and the Germans are gassing them and so on and so forth.

Greg:
It’s like I am in awe by people who have lost hundreds of pounds by the doctors who … darn, are risking their careers. That it’s astonishing. I don’t know that I would do that. I don’t know that I would put it on the line like that, but luckily I don’t.

Greg:
But I predict that within five years we are going to see a flip, such that people are going to deny and ignore that you used to live a very different lifestyle. I think that’s what’s going to happen. My prediction, someday I’d like to see Gay Pride parades go away. Why? Because we don’t need them. It’s just people pride.

Greg:
Similarly, we don’t need these kind of conferences because it’ll become part of our environment, and it’ll become a quaint thing.

Speaker 1:
I have a question. I’ve enjoyed meeting you a little while ago and your wonderful wife. Can you tell about in relationship how that plays out? I’d like to know.

Carole Freeman:
So I’ll just repeat so it gets on that audio better. Can you share how you’re keto lifestyle impacts your relationship with your wife?

Greg:
Yeah. My wife was there from ground zero when I found out, and she saw my father go through that thing. So, it’s been going on for years, and I’ve done lots of dumb things.

Greg:
I remember this cereal I used to eat, Kashi, right? It was like you cook this stuff, and let’s just say there was a lot of biological creations around it. Anyway, it took me years to get behind it.

Greg:
When I started doing fasting for example, she thought I was suffering. And she couldn’t understand why after day three I’m full of energy? So anyway, she cooks a lot, most of the cooking in the house. She’s a fantastic cook. When I come off a fast I come home to this incredible thing.

Greg:
My favorite thing right now is … What are those pork rinds?

Speaker 1:
They’re pork rinds.

Greg:
They’re some high end pork rinds.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, the Epic brand?

Greg:
Yes. And my favorite thing is a bag of those with liver pate that she makes. It’s almost like a sexual experience. It’s that good, and my sex life is pretty good too. Which I … That’s not what? So, no, we talk about all kinds of stuff.

Greg:
One of the things that has improved dramatically is our sex lives. I mean, it’s kind of … Really, I guess this is the only environment you can really talk about it. I am way more whatever. She’s satisfied, let’s just say that, and I’m satisfied.

Greg:
But the thing is, is that she’s an incredible support. We are on the same page. She got certified as a keto coach. I just blab all the time. We’re teaching a night school class for the second time in September. I’m going to come at it differently.

Greg:
The thing I want to start off with, and I think she’d get behind this, is that I’m going to say, “What would I do if I got cancer?” Right? Because that’s not a question people answer, and the answer’s really easy. I would immediately follow standard care. I would get surgery. I would do chemo. I would do radiation.

Greg:
However, I also would have doctors and hospital sign a contract that you will not feed me your crap diet, or you will be sued. Right? In other words, they’re not going to sign it. But the point is our hospitals are designed to keep us sick. And it’s through forcing change that way, I would bet my life on. I’m just saying. Yes, in the-

Speaker 2:
You mentioned the weight loss, but was your diabetes reversed? You started with that-

Greg:
Oh, yeah.

Carole Freeman:
The question is then, you lost weight, but did you reverse your diabetes?

Greg:
Yeah, so that happened first. In the last go around in the last 58 weeks, I lost 30 pounds. I know we all, we shouldn’t look at weight as a thing. But I’m an engineer and I measure everything, so I look at trends over weeks. So you definitely saw the numbers reverse first.

Greg:
Yes?

Speaker 3:
Thank you for sharing your story, and it was very powerful. You mentioned in passing about fasting and the loose skin and autophagy. Have you seen the results from that?

Carole Freeman:
The question is, have you seen results from reduction of the skin from autophagy and fasting?

Greg:
I would say given that I have an almost Speedo-like bathing suit and my wife often comments that I look good, that the answer is yes. And also, because I measure everything, I’m doing the Dr. Ben workout. That’s part of the reason why I’m here. I’ve done all my skin measurements, and definitely the waist has gotten smaller.

Greg:
So, I would guess, given my whatever the … Given my situation, it’s probably going to take another year to a year and a half to achieve the final goal.

Speaker 1:
How long do you fast and how often?

Carole Freeman:
What’s your fasting protocol?

Greg:
Right. Right now, I’m going to switch it up when I come back. But what I do is I fast each Sunday night, and then I eat Wednesday night. Then I eat Thursday night, Friday night, and then I go off the rails on the weekend.

Greg:
What the data show is that I need to change that up a little bit. That is, I think I’m going to do one meal a day, seven days a week with carnivore, and just see how it goes. The numbers don’t lie. I have a continuous glucose monitor on, which I absolutely love.

Greg:
It gives you a calculation of A1C every day, and your average blood sugar. Therefore, it’s a good feedback.

Carole Freeman:
So, when you say you go off the rails on the weekend, you mean you’re still eating keto, just-

Greg:
Yeah, so I’m still eating keto. I tend to keep my carbs down below 20, but my protein will often go through the roof. Then I see the blips in my blood sugar.

Carole Freeman:
So you’ve noticed that you tend to be a little more sensitive to protein then?

Greg:
Yes. That appears to be the case.

Carole Freeman:
What’s the amount of protein on the weekends that you’re eating compared to the week?

Greg:
Well, during the week I’m somewhere around 100, 110 grams a day. The weekend I can go 140 or more, depending, so it’s just interesting.

Carole Freeman:
Yes. All right. Yeah, any other questions for Greg? Yes?

Speaker 4:
If he has a problem with protein, how do you think going carnivore’s going to-

Carole Freeman:
She’s asking about how going carnivore manages-

Greg:
Yeah, that’s a good point. So, just heavy duty on the fat. My favorite these days is pork belly. Pork belly’s definitely balanced that way. So the idea is I come home and I’m just … I have to push the plate away usually. I just can’t eat much of it. So, I’m just going keep more of an eye on the protein, and just amp up on the fat. Which is another thing, I just had a DEXA scan, that’s why I was late for this. What’s interesting, I did it last year on the east coast. My body fat, according to them, has come down by almost 3%, which is interesting. So I’m 18.7 right now. Not bad. So, okay?

Carole Freeman:
Yeah. Thank you, Greg, so much for sharing your story. Very inspiring, thank you.

Speaker 2:
Wow. [crosstalk 00:44:19].

Carole Freeman:
This is Greg’s wife that wants to share next. Yes.

Susan:
Susan.

Carole Freeman:
Susan. Come on up, Susan.

Susan:
[inaudible 00:44:28].

Carole Freeman:
My name is Carole Freeman, Susan. I’ll call Tyler, I’ll put you on deck.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Okay. [crosstalk 00:44:37].

Carole Freeman:
Just a warning. Yes, put the weights on the back and start warming up. Susan, welcome.

Susan:
Thank you so much.

Carole Freeman:
Tell us where you’re from.

Susan:
We’re from New Hope, Pennsylvania, a little town between Philadelphia and New York City. This is our first time here. I have a ketogenic coaching credential that I use primarily credentialing to have form around learning. I love to learn. I don’t coach, other than as a volunteer. And I use it to support our advocacy efforts.

Susan:
I have a regular job selling advertising for an association. The head of which used to be the head of the American Diabetes Association. So looking at my everyday life, how can I affect each and every person that we come in contact with, including the potential of the association world.

Susan:
I’ve gone into the HR person of the American Society of Association Executives to get a sense of could a program be brought in there? Like a Virta, or something like that. And boy, you do get a lot of push back. Every time I open my mouth, and I’m just trying to be more responsible for speaking relevantly and accurately, and not just off the cuff.

Susan:
I’ve been married to Greg for, it will be 24 years. Now, I used to be 20 pounds overweight. I was reading my aunt’s Weight Watcher’s book at eight years old.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, God.

Susan:
I have two sisters close in age to me, and they were always lean. Looking back they’ve always ate more protein and fat than me. They’d have a bacon, egg, and a pancake. I’d have a piece of bacon and a stack of pancakes. Like an insatiable, very different personality, an emotional eater. Did all the diets.

Susan:
So when Greg and I got together, because Greg was overweight as a child, we had an interest in how do you deal with this? We did the low fat, high carb for a while. Then did Adkins, felt very sick on that, too much protein. So about two decades, we’ve been doing low carb. But started keto, for me, it was about one year ago. I did it more out of curiosity to help him as a wife, and I got two incredible, unexpected results. I don’t really talk about it, which is why I want to be up here. But I have two conditions that are virtually gone.

Susan:
One is sinusitis. I was scoring a steroid up my nose for about 15 years, back when it wasn’t available over the counter. I would be paranoid to not have that with me at all times. My nose would close. I didn’t like that feeling of not breathing at night. And I have not used a steroid for a year.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, my God.

Susan:
And I can breathe through my nose. Sometimes I get a little stuffy, but I’ll use that Arm & Hammer salt saline in the shower, but not what I had. I don’t know how to explain that to anyone, but you all understand.

Susan:
Inflammation lowering. The second one is actually a more serious condition I have called occipital neuralgia. I might cry a little because, I don’t know if it’s women, but we don’t seem to complain. We kind of tolerate our pain. So I had a little whiplash from a car accident. I have mild arthritis in my neck.

Susan:
The way occipital neuralgia presents itself, based on my neurologist, is as if you’re having an aneurism. There’s something happens that you get pain on one side of the head. It took me a while to get my brain and my neck MRI, so they could see it was not a aneurism.

Susan:
It’s also our modern day, the way we hold our neck with the computer. So my neurologist said he sees four cases of this a day. It’s becoming more common, and when you stress it’s even worse. So, I suffered on and off with debilitating pain from my neck, caused the worse when I got stress situations in my leg.

Susan:
So, anyway, over a year ago I went to the neurologist and he said this is lifestyle related. I wasn’t doing keto. I didn’t even know really what it was, and if it could even help me. No issues, none, other than mild tension, but not the pain. So the inflammation lowering is astounding. And more to come on that.

Susan:
I don’t know what to do with that, other than to share it. And with the hopes that if this can lower my inflammation, who else can this help? How can we help people who are on opioids, for example? I understood did opioids with the kind of pain I got from my neck.

Susan:
I am just feeling pretty good, and enjoying the eating. And doing more strength training, because I have osteopenia. I seriously want to build my lean body mass. I think I’m going to be around for a while based on my other health markers. My grandmother died at 100. I want to do what I can to be strong and to have a clear mind and to help people.

Speaker 1:
Were children involved? Do you have children [crosstalk 00:50:49]?

Carole Freeman:
Do you have children?

Susan:
Four children together.

Speaker 1:
How do you handle food with children?

Susan:
Well, the youngest graduated out of college and we’re really glad to be empty nesters. She’s actually a vegan.

Greg:
Unhealthy.

Susan:
She’s 23 and just eats even bad as a vegan, and just-

Speaker 1:
When they come to your house for meals, how does that play out?

Susan:
On and off, where mostly they tell us to shut up. We are advocates and we talk a lot about it. But you see some tweaking with them. It was my son who told me first about bullet proof coffee and I thought it was the grossest thing. Now, today I’m like, “Do you have two pats of butter?”

Susan:
Our daughter lives in New Zealand and was home visiting. I was cooking bone marrow in the oven, and she woke up from sleeping. She’s a vegan and she like, “What is that smell?”

Susan:
So we have hope, because we think she definitely takes more after dad and genetically is going to face some problems. She already has. She’s got a lot of weight here. Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
Any other questions for Susan? Yeah, Cocoa?

Cocoa:
I want to know your workout lady. Those guns are amazing.

Susan:
Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
Question’s about your workout. What’s your routine?

Susan:
Thank you first so much. This is all new to me. I did not have these arms. I do, do Dr. Ben’s Slow Maximum Resistance Training. And I have to thank Greg for getting me up in the morning twice a week and lifting very safely, very heavy weights. Getting my heart rate up.

Greg:
Slowly.

Susan:
Slowly and mindfully, and full body. I think part of this is genes too, because I just … Just not me. I’m trying to step into this, and-

Greg:
[crosstalk 00:52:59] love your guns.

Susan:
But, thank you for my guns.

Cocoa:
Just don’t go across the border because you won’t be able to come back with those guns.

Susan:
Thank you.

Cocoa:
Beautiful. Wow.

Carole Freeman:
All right. Thank you so much, Susan, for sharing your story. [crosstalk 00:53:16] pain relief this is. Because there’s another thing you might hear from other people too. Is how powerful this is for pain relief.

Susan:
Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you so much for being here.

Susan:
[crosstalk 00:53:24].

Carole Freeman:
All right. I’m going to ask Tyler Cartwright to come up and share his story. I’m going to check the time here. Okay, we’re about an hour in, that’s good. So, it’s about 10:30 right now, right?

Cocoa:
Yeah.

Carole Freeman:
Okay. All right.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So sure, we’ll go with that.

Carole Freeman:
Welcome Tyler Cartwright, please say your name. I already did that. Where you from?

Tyler Cartwrite:
I live outside of Nashville, Tennessee. [inaudible 00:53:55]. Sorry, my name is Tyler Cartwright. You already did that, so.

Carole Freeman:
I did, yes, yes. Do I need to ask you questions the whole time to tell your story?

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yes, that’s how this goes. Yes.

Carole Freeman:
No. No, because you’re going to talk for quite a while.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Does this actually work? I can’t … There’s no-

Carole Freeman:
You got to hold it closer to your mouth.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Like in my mouth?

Carole Freeman:
Yes. Well, not that far.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Okay.

Carole Freeman:
There, that’s perfect. Tyler, please share your story.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Sure.

Carole Freeman:
Start at the beginning. You where born where? No, I’m just kidding.

Tyler Cartwrite:
I was born in a small town called Princeton, Kentucky. So, about 13 years ago, I weighed a quarter of a ton. I’ve dropped about 300 pounds and I’ve maintained for about the last three and a half years or four years at about 205. Right now, let’s just call this bulking season, and we’ll say it’s about 225 and we’ll move on.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you, that’s it. You’re done. No, I’m just kidding. That’s amazing. That’s great.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yeah, the conference season always takes its toll. So once the conference season’s over it’s back to the gym and back to the chicken breast. And we get back in the gym a little more. So, yeah, I guess that’s it. No.

Tyler Cartwrite:
We actually started a company called Ketogains a few years ago. Trying to help people who were looking to try and … There was a lot of information that was out there around endurance training. Or just couch surfing lifestyles, for lack of a better way to describe it, of people.

Tyler Cartwrite:
But, there were also a lot of people who were like, “Hey, I’d like to lift weights too. But there’s no information on how do this in a way that makes any sense relevant to everything we know about muscle hypertrophy and strength gains and those sorts of things. Where’s the information?”

Tyler Cartwrite:
So, Luis and I started telling everybody, “This is how you do it if you want to do this.” The communities across all social media, about a quarter of a million people now. We did the math and … I was actually talking with one of the doctors outside. It’s interesting, we were tracking about 850 or so of our clients over the last three and a half years that we worked with. They’re almost 90,000 pounds down at this point across the 2,700 or so folks that we’ve worked with over the last four years using that backwards math.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Because I was a telecom engineer and I can do basic math as well. Yeah, we’re somewhere just over a quarter million pounds lost. We would just over about 380,000 inches gone. And across our whole community based on some data and polling that we did, it would be about 1.6 million pounds that people have lost just in the last four years.

Speaker 1:
Wow. Wow.

Carole Freeman:
Amazing, yeah.

Tyler Cartwrite:
By the way, never do upper body and then hold a microphone 45 minutes after you leave the gym. I’m up here like [crosstalk 00:56:46].

Carole Freeman:
Do you need me to hold it for you [crosstalk 00:56:46]?

Tyler Cartwrite:
I need a spotter. I need somebody to stay over here. So, yeah-

Carole Freeman:
Well, you and Luis are going to be doing a breakout session on-

Tyler Cartwrite:
We’ll be back here I think on Friday. We’re talking about sustain change and some of the habits that we actually see between people who make changes. We kind of recidivistically return back to where they were, versus those who seem to make it a lifestyle change. Right? And there are some pretty marked difference.

Carole Freeman:
Wonderful. And you guys are out there busting the myths about a couple of things for sure. Is that you don’t need massive amounts of carbs to grow muscle.

Tyler Cartwrite:
You don’t.

Carole Freeman:
You also don’t need to fear protein.

Tyler Cartwrite:
You really don’t. It’s funny people are like, “Oh, those guys are high protein.” I’m like, “No, I’m high exercise. There’s a difference.” Right? Recommendation, I was talking to somebody who said, “You guys are just high protein.” I said, “The funny thing is, if you do the math on me from [inaudible 00:57:45], and then you look at our recommendations. I am recommending six grams more protein per day.”

Tyler Cartwrite:
The delta is not as big as people like to make it out to be. I think there’s just a perception because I’m a big guy, and Luis looks like he could bench press a Buick, that somehow we’re eating 700 grams of protein a day. As much as I’d like to try, 100% sure I’d just be in a meat comma laying in a parking lot somewhere, and they’d call the ambulance.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yeah, started a company selling packeted electrolytes. So, I’ve joked that I’m like Salty Claus at all these conferences. If you find me you can have a non-alcoholic margarita in three seconds.

Carole Freeman:
You have [inaudible 00:58:27] for Element.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yeah, we are now officially the hydration drink of the United States of America’s Weight Lifting Team. They have actually recognized that what we’ve been saying for 10 to 12 years now, you don’t need carbs to be strong. You may need some carb to recover, but you don’t need carbs to be strong. Those two things are just completely antithetical to one another. We’ve known that for 75 years in the research. But never get between a pro and his science.

Carole Freeman:
Yeah, question?

Speaker 1:
I missed the very first part when you said you’re with Keto-

Tyler Cartwrite:
Luis and I actually started a company called Ketogains. It’s actually on my mug, which was totally not intentionally plugged. I just realized that it’s facing everybody. I didn’t mean for that to be a thing.

Carole Freeman:
It’s not on my camera [crosstalk 00:59:14].

Tyler Cartwrite:
No, I’m talking about those folks out there, because, again, I’m shaky and I didn’t want to sit here and try to hold two things.

Speaker 1:
So, are you keto or are you carnivore?

Tyler Cartwrite:
I am keto, although I joke that I’m 94% carnivore most of the time because I’m funny about plant foods. Over the years I’ve realized that it’s not so much that I don’t like plants, or plant-based foods, there’s just a lot of plant-based foods that don’t like me.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Things that cause me to walk around feeling like the stay puff marshmallow man after I eat them for a while. So I tend to be very specific. I eat a lot of berries as a recovery, either pre or post. So I’ll have some strawberries or blueberries or something along those lines.

Tyler Cartwrite:
A lot of spinach salads when I want something bulky. Plus you also get some iron and some iodine and some other fun stuff in that. Honestly, occasionally I’ll sneak in green beans, but legumes and I have a love/hate thing in general. Onions, peppers, that sort of thing, but most of the time it’s turf and turf. That’s range in which I live.

Tyler Cartwrite:
I’m in the middle of arguing with my HOA over whether my stick burning smoker that I want is a mobile chimnea, or whether it’s actually a stick burning smoker. Because they’ll allow one, but not the other. So I tend to be whatever goes in the smoker and can stay there for 12 hours is what I eat. So I would not call me carnivore, but I’m carnivore adjacent.

Speaker 2:
So, as you talk about protein, sorry, how many grams of protein per kilogram of body weight do you recommend?

Tyler Cartwrite:
You’re going to make me to do math [crosstalk 01:00:53].

Speaker 2:
[crosstalk 01:00:56].

Tyler Cartwrite:
Generally speaking I would say that it really depends. The research says that about 0.7 grams per pound of lean body mass. It’s kind of a hard stop if you want to avoid lean mass losses. But that delta then moves, because as we get older we become less sensitive to lucine, which is one of the amino acids in protein.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So as we get older, in order to stay monopenia and muscle loss and osteopenia, we actually do need to eat more protein. I said this because keto is to some degree lean mass bearing. It is not in any way magically antibolic. It does tend to waste less protein in bereft period of time when you’re not eating large amounts of protein.

Tyler Cartwrite:
There is kind of a natural advantage as we age to thinking about moving into a lower carb modality, even if you don’t want to go full scale keto. Because you can get away with probably 15 or 20 grams a day less protein than you would if you were eating more of a standard American or a western diet.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So for the average rank and file person, somewhere between 0.68 and 0.8 grams per pound of lean body mass is going to be ideal. I like anchoring it to lean body mass, because if we use total body mass, then when I was 505 pounds, I would’ve been eating nine pounds of meat a day. That’s just nuts, right?

Tyler Cartwrite:
If somebody was coming in, like my partner Luis was actually anorexic on college and was … I think he told me 64 kilos at his lowest, and he’s 5’9. So I mean he’s not a completely diminutive guy. On those sides of the situation you would actually be under eating protein relative to your actual physiologic needs.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So, lean mass is really the metabolically active part of us. It’s organ tissue, bone tissue, it’s muscle tissue, it’s all of that. That doesn’t do anything. In terms it’s 0.1 calorie per hour per pound of fat or something insanely minuscule. So we don’t need to really consider it with respect to how much protein we should be eating in any given day.

Speaker 2:
How does fasting fit into what you do?

Carole Freeman:
How does fasting fit in?

Tyler Cartwrite:
I tend towards the Virta model. I will recognize that if I was actually chasing maximal strength performance and that sort of thing that the answer would be three to four times a day I would need to eat full stop. I tend to eat one or two times a day, predominantly because I’m just fricking busy.

Tyler Cartwrite:
We run about 800 clients at any point in time and they all deserve what we can do. Right? It’s anytime you do your job. I was a pastor for seven years, and it’s whatever you put your hand to, do it to the best of your abilities. Right?

Tyler Cartwrite:
So, yeah, I mean there’ll be days when I look up, I’m like, “Oh, it’s 9:00 at night and I haven’t had anything to eat. I probably should put food in me.” So I’ve anchored it to where I’ll have something protein based, either liquid or meals before I train. Then, I’ll usually have an actual substantive meal later in the day.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So, it’s not that I’m really intentional and I got the app on my phone or watching a clock or anything. But I just gravitate towards maybe a 16/8 or a 14/10 range. I was sitting here going, “God, I hope I don’t get those numbers wrong.” “You have 26 hour days where you live?”

Tyler Cartwrite:
What do you want back there, Burdah?

Michael Burdah:
You mentioned when you were a quarter of a ton, so 500 pounds-

Tyler Cartwrite:
505 at my heaviest.

Michael Burdah:
505, wow.

Tyler Cartwrite:
And I had to be measured on a grain scale or a loading scale on the back of our doctors office. After I got measured the nurse looked at me, started crying and hugged me.

Michael Burdah:
You might have actually just answered my question, because what I was going to ask, was there a specific moment where you were like, “I might literally be killing myself? Then, B, did that result in a ketogenic diet, or doing a thousand other diets and then eventually you [inaudible 01:04:58] ketogenic diet?

Tyler Cartwrite:
It’s funny, I tell the story and I’ve talked about the nurse hugging me. I’d love to find her, but I have no idea. I didn’t get a name at the time. Good news I haven’t seen that doctor in 14 years because I’m not normally sick. And I’ve got another doctor that actually agrees with what I do, that takes good care of any medications that I need.

Tyler Cartwrite:
It’s funny, she reached over and started crying and hugged me. I was sitting there thinking, “Lady, it’s not like I didn’t know I was fat when I walked in here.” I didn’t have this spontaneous moment where I was like, “All this time I thought I was just like when you’re in the pool and your swimsuit puckers around.” That’s not what happened, right? I knew I was morbidly obese.

Tyler Cartwrite:
But, I tell people all the time, a lot, I was like, “You don’t get to a quarter of a ton because you have a healthy relationship with food.” Right? You’re eating your emotions. You’re eating a lot of things. Then it becomes, I was the Fat Bastard from the Austin Power’s movies. Because, “I’m unhappy and unhappy because I eat.” That’s the worst Scottish impression you’ll ever hear.

Tyler Cartwrite:
It became that, right? I was eating because I was unhappy because you get into the potus of life and everything is going wrong. I’ve dealt with depression and social anxiety my whole life. And there’s always comfort in two extra large all meat pizzas. Ben and Jerry never let me down once.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Then you get to a point where you have to eat, because I would literally fall asleep driving to work. To the point where my boss basically said, “You can just stay at home because you’re not safe to drive.” I would sleep 18 to 20 hours a day. And had to figure out ways to shoehorn nine or 10 hours worth of work every day into three or four hours. So I became hyper efficient as an engineer and a spreadsheet ninja so I guess that’s a plus.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Everybody wants the Biggest Loser moment where … There’s a really crass version of this that I tell sometimes when I’ve had a glass of vodka, but I won’t do that version. But, everybody wants to find out, “Oh, I’ve been hiding this horrible secret or this thing that I don’t want the rest of the world to know.”

Tyler Cartwrite:
“Now, that I’m out and sharing it and everything, now, I can deal with all of this stuff.” And it’s never that. Nobody got a quarter of a ton because they had one thing wrong. It was the cascade of things that were defective and broken.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Then when you get that weight … I mean, my wife was desperately wanting a child, we physically didn’t fit together. Sorry for being direct, but after we talked about sex life, I feel like I can jump that shark a little bit and come back. Those are things and those are the moments that you realize what a failure you are. So, I’ll try and boil this down to the three minute version because it’s a long story. But, my mother wrote me a letter. Yeah, this is the Tyler cries portion. My mother is 5’2, and about 135 pounds soaking wet. I once called her a magic B word when I was 17 years old. She grabbed me …

Tyler Cartwrite:
Now, you need to understand I was an 1800 pound free lift guy at 17 years old. I was full of muscle, piss and vinegar. And I called her a word that you should never call a woman or a mother. And I’m pretty sure people get uncomfortable even when you call a female dog this.

Tyler Cartwrite:
She snatched me by the ear, all 6’0 230 pounds of 6% body fat me, and drug me around the room slapping me in the face. And yelling, “I don’t need to wait till your father gets home, we’re going to take care of this right now.” All I could say was, “Yes, ma’am. Yes, ma’am. Yes, ma’am,” over and over and over.

Tyler Cartwrite:
That’s the kind of personality that we’re talking about in my mother. She is an old school country girl from Kentucky. She wrote me a letter that said, “Tyler, moms aren’t supposed to bury their sons.” It was pretty emotionally gut wrenching. But I put on my 17 year old hat and decided I was just going to be angry at her and screw her and the world, and everybody else.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So, not long after that I was actually at Leone’s in Landing, Kentucky, and hunt pretty regularly. I was up there and I got up at 3:00 to get ready to go out into the woods for deer season’s opening day. My dad wasn’t in the bed, because we tend to share a king size. And we do the man thing where you face opposite directions so it’s not weird. And he wasn’t in the bed.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So I got up and saw him sitting … He’s a heart attack survivor with a fake knee, so you assume bad things unfortunately when you wake up and somebody’s not there. So I’m checking the other side of the bed. I get up and I go in the living room and he’s sitting there and he’s crying.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Now, to tell the story, I once buried a treble hook, if any of you have ever fished, it’s the little hook with three hooks on it, into his back when I was six years old. I mean down to the shank. We went to the marina where they sterilized a box knife with kerosene. Which I’m not even sure is a thing, but it seemed like a thing, because we had watched Rambo.

Tyler Cartwrite:
And had them to cut the flesh off around the barbs, and yank this thing out with a big chunk of his back. And he did not make a noise. My dad played football at the University of Kentucky and watched several of his teammates die because of stupid drills done in ridiculous conditions that would be completely illegal now.

Tyler Cartwrite:
This is the kind of guy I’m talking about. My dad was in tears. He said, “I want you to know something.” He said, “I stayed up all night last night listening to my son’s last breath every 90 seconds.” He said, “You’re going to die.”

Tyler Cartwrite:
He said, “I’m never going to bring it up again, but I owe it to you to say this.” He said, “You only breathe every 90 seconds when you sleep. And when you do breathe you gasp for air like a drowning man fighting to stay above the water.” He said, “I have no idea how you’re not dead yet, but you’re making your way there.”

Tyler Cartwrite:
Came back, I had bought an F-150. The seat didn’t work, the seatbelt didn’t work. I was too big. But I bought the F-150 because its seat went far enough back that I could clear the steering without it being a huge issue.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So I went to the dealership to get seatbelt extenders. And the lady who was at the parts counter, it was young girl, was like a size negative four. I don’t know if that’s an actual size, but I think that her waist was actually inverted.

Tyler Cartwrite:
God bless her, there’s the thing in engineering or in life called Hanlon’s Razor. This is never ascribed in malice, that which was adequately explained by incompetence. I had to tell her three times what the thing was. Now, I want you to understand there was a 85 year old man in the room, who was about as big around as my left arm.

Tyler Cartwrite:
There was a young Indian lady, and then there was me at 500 pounds. So she proceeds to come back into a parts counter smaller than this room. And instead of saying, “Sir, your parts are ready.” She gets over the PA system and announces, by the way not only to the parts counter, but to the entire property, “The gentleman with the seatbelt extenders, your parts are ready. Come to the parts counter and pick them up,” while looking at me.

Tyler Cartwrite:
I just wanted to look at her and say, “Are there any other bearded fat guys here that would need this? Is this a thing?” So I took them and I left. And I did what I always do, I went to my favorite Mexican restaurant called the Lazy Donkey. It doesn’t exist anymore sadly.

Tyler Cartwrite:
You know you eat some place too often when the restaurant has a table for you. And I mean it’s your table. And it’s also the only table you fit at in the entire restaurant, which is why it’s your table. I got there and they actually moved a family. They literally just made them get up and move. Like I was the fattest mafia Don that ever existed.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So I sat down and they didn’t even take my order, because they knew what I got. It was two chicken chimichangas, double rice, large bowl of cheese dip and all the chips you can bring. And bring me two Cokes because you can’t keep up with me. And they did.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Right as the food came out I remember leaning back to get out of the way, because they kept screaming, “Hot plate,” like they do at every Mexican restaurant. So yeah, I felt the chair crack. I then went kind of black when I hit the floor. And when I woke up maybe two or three seconds later I was coated from mid nipple to mid knee in cheese dip and rice.

Tyler Cartwrite:
So I got up and threw $20 on the counter and literally ran to the truck. I drove out to a spill way dam, which is not far from my house. There’s a little eddy where the water is still and people have little picnics and stuff. And the kids can swim out in the water and play. And I just had a moment.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Like, Tyler’s going to break down and cry, everything is weepy. I just realized I was failing as a husband and as a son, and as an employee, and as a human being, and as a pastor. And as all of these other things.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Meanwhile, halfway there I had realized that my pants were too tight. My size 64 elastic waisted pants were too tight. I had to unbutton them because you swell throughout the day when you’re that large. So I’m sitting there and I have this moment of realization that I am bawling to the point that my eyes are swollen. My face is red.

Tyler Cartwrite:
The window is cracked because it is pretty warm. I have my pants unbuttoned with what looks like dried cheese, if you know what just happened to me, all over my lap. And I’m watching children in bathing suits swimming in water across the way, and crying like Baby Huey.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Like, if these people call the police, I’m going to federal prison. There is no way I’m ever going to be able to explain what just happened. It was one of those things. I’m a big reader of philosophy and existential stuff and stoicism and that sort of thing.

Tyler Cartwrite:
And it was one of those moment where I just said, “Hey, I wonder now that I’ve stared at the abyss and I’m basically dead, can I come back. And if I can come back, how far can I come back?” So, like the science nerd that I am, it looks just kind of like the science experiment, right? I became my own control group to see how far I can come back.

Tyler Cartwrite:
I tried every stupid thing under the sun. Every fasting hack, every keto hack, everything along the way. And there’s a reason it took me 11 or 12 years to really get to a point of this is where I’m at. Because I did a lot of stupid stuff, because there weren’t really a lot of resources out there.

Tyler Cartwrite:
These kinds of conferences didn’t exist. The closest thing you had was an occasional podcast with somebody or something along those lines. An occasional forum somewhere that was kind of vested to the Adkin’s movement from the early 90s or whatever, and there was just that. So you picked up Ronald McDonald’s the Ketogenic Diet book on the internet in PDF form and read that monster.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Then I was actually going through school at the time so I had access to scientific libraries. So I grabbed every single reference study that he cited in that book and began to read through the reference material. I read through all the Finney stuff and the Bullock stuff.

Tyler Cartwrite:
A number of the older studies that were being cited even in the Finney papers. So 13 plus years later, 1.6-ish million pounds later this is where we are.

Speaker 1:
Awesome.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Can you beat box by the way?

Carole Freeman:
Can I beat box? No.

Tyler Cartwrite:
[crosstalk 01:17:20]. What’s that? I’m sure she is. It’s all good.

Carole Freeman:
Amazing. Thank you.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
That’s as good as I can do.

Tyler Cartwrite:
You sound like an old Model T trying to start, but somebody didn’t crank the engine well enough.

Carole Freeman:
Chitty-chitty bang-bang.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yeah, okay, nice.

Speaker 1:
What’s your website?

Tyler Cartwrite:
It’s just www.ketogains.com.

Carole Freeman:
Ketogains.com with an S, not a Z.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yes.

Carole Freeman:
As cool as that would be.

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yeah. Apparently we don’t live in the 90s, so Xtreme without the E.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you so much for sharing. That’s amazing. Again, a breakout session Friday, tomorrow at noon, [crosstalk 01:17:54].

Tyler Cartwrite:
Yeah, you’ll have to either skip your lunch or bring your lunch if you’re going to hang out here. It’s 12:45 I think.

Carole Freeman:
Yeah. Thank you so much, Tyler.

Speaker 1:
Wow.

Carole Freeman:
Right.

Speaker 1:
[crosstalk 01:18:04]. This is fabulous.

Carole Freeman:
Yeah, who’s up next? Come on up. Yeah. Abby, can I ask you, would you get me a glass of water?

Abby Ross:
Yeah, sure.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, thank you so much.

Abby Ross:
What would you like in it?

Carole Freeman:
Well, salt would be great, but I don’t know if you’ve got that handy?

Abby Ross:
[crosstalk 01:18:21].

Carole Freeman:
Kim, come on up. Let’s hear your story. Kim, where are you from?

Kim:
Phoenix, Arizona.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, wonderful.

Kim:
But, we have a boat and we’re so blessed. And a boat in San Diego.

Carole Freeman:
Nice. I love … that’s my favorite color, your shirt.

Kim:
And we get to stay on it for the summer. It’s really [inaudible 01:18:33] have this beautiful weather. I grew up not having really any health issues, except when I was young I had [inaudible 01:18:40] all the time. But then got married and had kids and felt great.

Kim:
I did … not vegan. I tried vegan, but it didn’t work. I did, I would say high carb, low fat. I swore that that’s what’s going to keep me going. Then I hit menopause and I’m 63. I was like, “Oh, my God, this is not working.” I gained a lot of weight. Put on weight for the last 12 years.

Kim:
In ’09, I was in a really bad car accident and broke a vertebrae. Fractured both wrist, my hand. I had to have multiple surgeries. The weight just, oh my gosh, it started climbing. Menopause and that accident, and just struggled and struggled.

Kim:
Well, I went to a doctor a year ago, somebody recommended. And Adam now, I don’t know if any of you are familiar with him, he is in Phoenix, and he recommended I do the keto. Well, when I first heard it I thought, no. I’ve been my whole life doing low fat. How can you … High fat just kind of scared me.

Kim:
So the last year I’ve played with it, and I would try a little bit. I actually became low carb last year. It’s funny, when I heard Low Carb USA I thought, “Oh, it’s just going to be low carb. I know all about Adkins.” I didn’t know that so many people would be doing high fat, moderate protein, high fat. I was shocked.

Kim:
So, I thought this validates what my doctor said. All these people, I hear all these success stories so I really wanted to get on the program and stick with it. Unfortunately, I didn’t. Christmas come and I got off track. Then after Christmas we went to Hawaii for two weeks.

Kim:
My daughter was with us and she … unfortunately, I let her dietary influence … I didn’t stick to the low carb. I started right after Christmas, I should say keto, and I was on it till we went to Hawaii in January. Once we went to Hawaii I ate. I swear it’s hard to eat. I don’t know. I thought it was hard to eat low carb in Hawaii. Or at least that was my opinion then. Now I could go back and do it.

Kim:
But I ate every carb there was known to man in Hawaii. Everybody served rice, and it was just like, oh, my gosh. So I felt really crappy. I came back and I was like, “I’m going to start on my keto journey again.” And I didn’t.

Kim:
Then eight weeks ago, on a Sunday, we were at friends house and she does low carb too, and I didn’t even know she went to my doctor, or keto. I told her, “I don’t want the baked potato.” We had steak and asparagus. I said, “I’m just going to stick with the steak and asparagus.” She said, “That’s great. That’s great. I’m glad you’re doing that.”

Kim:
The next day we went to Costco, I thought well, I’m going to go to Costco and stock up. I’ll probably watch those videos about Costco holds on keto. So I’m might go stock up at Costco. We were walking in the middle of Costco and my legs from my waist down went numb.

Kim:
I couldn’t walk. My husband had to help me get to the food court, or the food area, and then he helped me get out to the car. Went to urgent care the next day. They diagnosed me with diabetic noropethy. I thought there’s just no way. A year ago my blood sugar was really good.

Kim:
I went to Dr. O’Nally the next day and he was really great. He didn’t lecture me on … And I’m using a cane. As soon as we got home my husband found my grandma’s cane I had, had for 10 years. That was the only way I could walk.

Kim:
So eight weeks ago, I was walking with a cane. I had started keto the day before. And I thought well, if anything I’m doing, keto might help. And here I am walking without a cane. It’s taken eight weeks for my numbness, and I’m totally numb still from my ankles down my feet. I can’t feel anything on my feet.

Kim:
I’m grateful I can walk. But I had chronic low back pain since ’09, because I fractured a vertebrae. One of my doctors, I went to a neurologist, she said, “Well, you could have inflammation from that vertebrae and it could be causing your numbness.”

Kim:
It scared the crap out of me. I had an anxiety attack like no other, thinking, oh my God, am I going to be this way? They want to rule out MS, an auto immune disorder. And that all came out fine. She thinks it’s my vertebrae that I fractured causing neurological issues.

Kim:
So anyway, I believe, and Dr. O’Nally was really, and he goes, “Well, it’s not life threatening. You’re okay. You’re not having a stoke.” So I watched myself get better over eight weeks and and I’m walking, not normal, but as good as I expected. And the pain in my back in eight weeks has diminished so much.

Kim:
I’m so grateful. I think this experience, why do we have to get where we have something life changing like that to realize okay I need to do this for life? The bonus, I’ve dropped 20 pounds in eight weeks.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, that’s fantastic. I’m so glad you’re here, because you’re going to feel … This is your tribe, and you’re going to feel so much more resolve and motivation to keep going with what you’re doing. Everybody goes to these conferences and you’re hugging at the end of this. You’re family.

Carole Freeman:
Other people have been to other types of conferences reflect on how you don’t experience that at a photography conference. But here you’re going to feel so much more motivation and excited to keep going. So congrats on all your success and thank you so much for sharing your story.

Kim:
Thank you.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you. I’m just going to show the camera really quickly because people are going to wonder what I just took. It actually it’s a pill bottle or what does it say on there? Pill bottle. But it’s actually little chunks of Himalayan pink salt. Somebody gave me in the audience, which is wonderful.

Kim:
[crosstalk 01:24:22].

Carole Freeman:
Oh, it’s a Redmonds. Okay, awesome my favorite kind. Thank you so much. I’m sitting here. It’s actually pretty warm and I feel myself sweating and feeling thirsty. But just downed a little water and that salt was perfect. So thank you so much. Let me check the time here. It’s about 11:00 isn’t it? Is that about right?

Michael Burdah:
Yes.

Carole Freeman:
Let’s do maybe one or two more stories. Yeah, come on up. [inaudible 01:24:50] going to do opening ceremonies I think at 11:30. Is that right?

Abby Ross:
Yes. Yes.

Carole Freeman:
We’ll go another 15 minutes or so. Thank you so much. Peggy, where are you from?

Peggy:
Hi I’m from Anaheim, California. I don’t have a great story. I’m an old lady. Me and Abby are almost the same. I’m 67 and I’ve been married almost 50 years. My husband doesn’t do keto. I started keto in June, a year ago, and I consider myself a PA. I’m practicing at it. I don’t get the whole macros. I mean I do my best, but I have lost 100 pounds.

Carole Freeman:
Oh, my gosh. I don’t have a fantastic story.

Peggy:
But, I started in January a year ago, and my goal was to lower my blood pressure, because I do have high blood pressure. I don’t like doctors. I don’t go to doctors. If there’s any in here I’m sorry, nothing personal.

Peggy:
So it was probably, well, almost six months of me trying to lose weight, lower my blood pressure. So I cut out salt. I cut out all fats. I was eating oatmeal with nonfat milk with chicken breast broiled or boiled. Broccoli with nothing on it, no salt, no butter, no nothing.

Peggy:
So my sexual experience came when I started keto and I could put cream in my coffee and butter on my broccoli. That’s when I just thought the world was wonderful. Since then that’s just kind of what I do. I change it up when I go for a little while, and then that doesn’t seem to working anymore. Then I either add more fat or take away fat or add more protein. That’s my story.

Carole Freeman:
Well, that’s wonderful. Congrats on your success. Any questions you have? Abby?

Abby Ross:
Okay. So new relationship and everybody eats their own thing, and you’re cooking. How do you handle it?

Carole Freeman:
How does your different foods styles from your husband?

Peggy:
I just cook for him the way he eats and I cook for me the way I eat. And it’s okay. I mean I just made my grandson a triple decker chocolate cake for his eighth grade graduation. Because I can’t force them to do what I’m doing.

Abby Ross:
Do you find yourself when you’re with friends or other people that you’re on a soap box and you talk about it? Or how do you handle that? Because you’re a fabulous role model.

Peggy:
I talk about it a little bit to them. They all are waiting for me to drop dead with a heart attack because of all that fat I’m eating and my bacon. They’re starting to come around now that I’ve been doing it a year and I haven’t dropped dead yet. They’re starting to ask more questions but it’s been kind of slow.

Abby Ross:
Do you eat out a lot?

Peggy:
No, I don’t. But even when I was heavy I didn’t eat out a lot. I’m a homebody.

Greg:
So your opening is I don’t have a story. To use the term here, you just dropped an F bomb on us. It’s like, what do you mean? It’s an incredible story. For example, how did your biomarkers change?

Carole Freeman:
How did your biomarkers change? She doesn’t have a doctor.

Greg:
I don’t go to doctors so I don’t know.

Carole Freeman:
How about your blood pressure.

Peggy:
I do take my … My blood pressure is coming down. It’s not probably where a doctor would like it to be but it’s where lower than it is. And I don’t take any medication anymore for it. I quit when … I know that’s bad and everybody’s going to say that’s bad.

Greg:
Can I ask another question?

Carole Freeman:
Sure, Greg.

Greg:
I spend a lot of time trying to educate my doctor. I go in with 10 pages of stuff. “This is what I’m doing, and here’s the supporting paper to support it.” I don’t want to tell you what to do, but I just question why you don’t find somebody. We have one of the greatest doctors in the community in this town.

Peggy:
I don’t live in this town though.

Greg:
You’re a lot closer than I am. I’m just saying I have a doctor now who he’s keto-

Peggy:
And I will look for a keto doctor soon. This is all new to me. I still feel like I’m learning. I learn every day. Not to start any rumors. I sleep with Gary Taubes in my ear. I’m constantly listening, learning and reading. And trying to figure this all out. But I feel great I have more energy than I’ve ever had.

Peggy:
I was born without hip sockets. I had my first hip replacement when I was nine years old. I have stainless steel screws holding my kneecaps on, because they can fall off randomly. So my disdain for doctors comes from a lot of experience with them I guess.

Speaker 1:
Exercise?

Peggy:
You know what? I’m going to do that, I haven’t yet. I’m trying to walk a little more, but because of my hips I-

Speaker 1:
But the 100 pounds was not with exercise?

Peggy:
It was not with exercise. No. Not with exercise. I’m going to talk to hopefully Ben while I’m here this weekend. And see what he can do to point me in the right direction on-

Speaker 1:
Thank you so much.

Carole Freeman:
I think Greg is seeing a missed opportunity. He sees it as you can help change doctors in this world by sharing your [crosstalk 01:31:04] experiences.

Peggy:
I realize that now, but just like I said, every time I go to a doctor they want to slice and dice something.

Greg:
So in a different world, I do [inaudible 01:31:17]. One of the greatest things about being American that I’ve learned from this class. One thing we’re supposed to do is be useful to other Americans in the world. The story you have is incredible. And it isn’t even about you. It’s about us. We need you out there. Come out from the shadows.

Peggy:
[crosstalk 01:31:47].

Carole Freeman:
This is the great thing Greg is that, not only this room of people, but this is going to go out on YouTube and my 6000 subscribers will see it. But also it’s going to get shared out, shared out, and shared out. So she’s going [crosstalk 01:32:04] to be affecting much more people than just sharing with her doctor.

Greg:
I hope I don’t seem critical.

Peggy:
Oh no, no. Not at all.

Greg:
[crosstalk 01:32:11]. You are a diamond and not in the rough.

Peggy:
Again, it’s my past experience with doctors which has lended me to … And my husband too, my husband had a heart attack, gosh, almost 20 years ago. And he is just on a litany of medications. There’s a list that’s as long as my arm. And he refuses to change his diet. He still smokes. He quit smoking, and now he’s onto vaping which I guess is the thing to do. [crosstalk 01:32:53].

Peggy:
He eats Fritos and nacho cheese every night almost. It’s just crazy. And yet, he thinks if he takes his magic pill he’s going to live forever. I love him dearly, we’ve been married almost 50 years.

Speaker 2:
[inaudible 01:33:13].

Peggy:
They just keep thinking if they can take a pill for it. And I’m the opposite, I don’t want to take any pills for things.

Speaker 1:
Thank you so much.

Carole Freeman:
Thank you, Peggy, for your help.